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How “Christian” is Christian Zionism?


Since Stephen Strang of Charisma Magazine, joined up with John Hagee and the CUFI organization this year, its been interesting to read some of the articles Charisma posts in their new Standing With Israel section.

Not all of the articles are written by Christians, such as this one, (Who Crucified Zion?) written by David Brog, who is the executive director of John Hagee’s “Christians United For Israel” (CUFI). Brog, himself an American Jew, has never accepted Jesus as Messiah, but works along-side Hagee to promote political and financial support for Israel, from among American Evangelicals.

From an interview with CUFI’s David Brog:

Which Christians in the U.S. are most Zionist and why?

“The evangelicals. No contest. Their Zionism comes directly from their theology.”

Was there an event that made this alliance stronger? Has it always been under the radar?

“Evangelical Christians largely shunned politics until the late 1970s, when Jerry Falwell created the Moral Majority and led them back onto the political playing field. Israel was among the priorities of the Christian Right from the start. In fact, when Jerry Falwell founded the Moral Majority he made support for Israel one of the group’s four organizing principles along with the issue of abortion, traditional marriage, and a strong U.S. defense.”

(Concerning Converting Jews to Christ)

“The important question is this: Is evangelical support for Israel merely a tool in the effort to convert the Jews? Is this merely some scheme to soften the Jews up so that they can better sell Jesus to them? And the answer to this question is absolutely not. If anything, the opposite it true. I and others who have worked with Christians in support of Israel all report that no one has ever tried to convert us. In fact, Christians who support Israel tend to know more Jews and to understand their sensitivities better than Christians who do not. Thus, they have learned that Jews find “Jesus talk” offensive, and they tend to leave it out of the dialogue.”

*The underlining of specific words is my doing.

I want to also include a segment from an article concerning Christian Zionism, found at the website of the excellent organization, Jews for Jesus; a ministry, which for over 30 years has been diligent in pushing against the spiritual darkness, in order to evangelize lost Jews.

How “Christian” is Christian Zionism

“…there is a serious problem with Christian Zionism that cannot be chalked up to the biases or lack of balance that some critics demonstrate. That problem ought not go without scrutiny and censure, but unfortunately the average Christian is unaware of it. The problem is, many Christian Zionists are involved (some proactively, others unknowingly) in preventing Jews from hearing the gospel.

So maybe the time has come for us to ask, “How Christian is today’s Christian Zionism?”

Please note the word “today’s,” because the landscape of Christian Zionism has dramatically shifted in recent years.

In the United States, biblical Christian Zionism was promoted by a wide range of theologians, though it became more widespread, in part due to the rise of dispensational theology. William Blackstone championed the cause and rallied four hundred American business leaders and politicians—both Christian and Jewish—to sign a bold statement calling for the establishment of a Jewish homeland. That petition is known as the Blackstone Memorial. Blackstone was also committed to Jewish evangelism, and founded a Jewish mission agency known as “Life in Messiah.”

When Israel finally became a modern state in 1948, it was a glorious, faith-strengthening confirmation of biblical Christian Zionism. And when Jerusalem was reclaimed in 1967, many believed the “times of the Gentiles” had been fulfilled and the end-times scenario of rapture and tribulation was about to unfold.

Certainly there did seem to be many Jewish people coming to believe in Jesus in the late ’60s and early ’70s. Jews for Jesus came into existence during that time. Yet the numbers of Jesus-believing Jews, especially in Israel, remained few. One might think that Christian Zionism would see this as a challenge to be met by greater fervor and commitment to proclaiming the good news to Jewish people.

But curiously, the opposite occurred.

A new form of Christian Zionism emerged in the mid 1970s and early 1980s; it was more political and actually divorced itself from Jewish evangelism, contending that a Christian’s biblical duty to the Jews and Israel was best carried out through providing material comfort, political support and helping fund Jewish immigration to Israel.

These new Christian Zionist organizations, best represented by Bridges for Peace and the International Christian Embassy Jerusalem, made it very clear to Jewish leaders in Israel and abroad they had no intention of evangelizing Jews. Some, not all, of their leaders argued that evangelism of Jews was a waste of time and unnecessarily offensive. Jewish evangelism, in any case, was not a cause that would endear these leaders to the people with whom they were beginning to network. The hope seemed to be that eventually those networks would help open people’s hearts to the gospel in a way that direct evangelism would not. If this has proven to be the case, it is a well-kept secret.

Recently, the two above-mentioned organizations have been dwarfed in scope and influence by the rise of two other organizations: the International Fellowship of Christians and Jews (IFCJ) and Christians United For Israel (CUFI). These financial juggernauts successfully tap into the deep reservoir of Christian Zionist sentiment here in America.

(IFCJ raised 75 million dollars last year. CUFI does not disclose its finances but is on record as giving millions of dollars to various Jewish groups in Israel each year). Both organizations are currently run by Jewish people who do not know Jesus: Yechiel Eckstein of IFCJ is an Orthodox rabbi, and David Brog of CUFI an attorney and former chief of staff to Senator Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania.

These newer “Christian” Zionist organizations have set themselves against Jewish evangelism in ways that their predecessors did not.

In his book What Christians Should Know About Jews and Judaism (as well as in other printed material) Rabbi Eckstein suggests that, “The rejection of Jesus as Messiah is the key to Jewish survival.”

Accordingly, a good deal of the money Eckstein raises from Christians goes to organizations whose agendas include anti-missionary activity.

As for David Brog, in an interview with Katherine Jean Lopez on Beliefnet, he boasts on behalf of the Christians he knows that, “I and others who have worked with Christians in support of Israel all report that no one has ever tried to convert us,” and in his book Standing With Israel he says that

“While there is no evidence that the Christian-Jewish alliance in support of Israel [CUFI] facilitates the conversion of Jews, there is evidence that the alliance actually works to impede efforts to convert Jews” (David Brog, Standing With Israel, Lake Mary, Fla.: Frontline Publishers, 2006, 188-189)

While this is meant to reassure the Jewish community concerning Christian Zionists, it ought to have the opposite effect on Christians who care about the salvation of Jewish people. It might seem like the phrases “try to convert” or “efforts to convert” imply a certain overbearing attempt at sharing the gospel, but the fact is, Brog is referring to any attempt to tell Jewish people the gospel.

Washington Jewish Week interviewed Brog and published an article explaining,

“Brog said the group (CUFI) tells people, ‘If you cannot put aside your desire to share the Gospel with Jews, there’s the door'” (Eric Fingerhut, “Educating on Evangelicals.” Washington Jewish Week. July 4, 2007).

I am absolutely convinced the vast majority of Christians supporting CUFI and IFCJ do not know about these policies and practices. My guess is that many who support these groups genuinely believe in Jewish evangelism and expect that their support will help Jewish people come to Christ. Sadly, their resources are going to projects run by people who are committed to preventing Jewish people from hearing about Jesus.

..please consider this: When someone makes an appeal for Christians to show their love for Jewish people, please remember that our love is incomplete at best and misleading at worst if it does not point beyond ourselves and to the One who loved us so much that He sent His Son to die, so that WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM will not perish, but have eternal life.”

Thank you Lord for our Jewish brothers and sisters in Christ at Jews for Jesus. I pray you continue to bless them in their taking the Good News of Jesus Christ to lost Jews. amen.

A few quotes from Brog’s article at Charisma:

It is impossible for a thoughtful Christian to feel such deep gratitude to the Jewish people and not be painfully aware of how poorly this debt to the Jews has been repaid over the centuries.

The flip side of gratitude to the Jews is remorse over the long history of Christian and anti-Semitism. Many of the most passionate Christian Zionists are quick to express regret and even fury over the record of Christian persecution of the Jews. For these Christian Zionists, the need to make amends for the past adds a sense of urgency to the task of supporting Israel today.

For centuries, Christians outraged by the crucifixion of Christ unleashed their fury upon the Jews. John Hagee turns this traditional view of crucifixion on its head. Hagee too is outraged by the crucifixion. But it is the “crucifixion of the Jews” about which Hagee rages. And he is clear about who is responsible for this crucifixion: the Christian church.

Brog quotes Hagee:

“It is time for Christians to stop praising the dead Jews of the past-Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, while slandering the Jews that live across the street. They are the same.”

I will not even comment on those excerpts. You either see the ‘wrongness’ in it or you don’t.

But I will answer the question in the title: How “Christian” is Christian Zionism?. Its not Christian or biblical, in any way. Today’s Christian Zionist movements are enemies of the Gospel.

30 comments on “How “Christian” is Christian Zionism?

  1. “Christian Zionism,” really, is just idolatry.

    It’s that simple. Great article to illustrate the point. The idea of setting up a so-called Christian organization that doesn’t evangelize or do any outreach?

    That’s beyond absurd.

    • Wickle the statements by CUFI executive director David Brog says it all:

      Is evangelical support for Israel merely a tool in the effort to convert the Jews? Is this merely some scheme to soften the Jews up so that they can better sell Jesus to them? And the answer to this question is absolutely not. If anything, the opposite it true.

      “Brog said the group (CUFI) tells people,

      ‘If you cannot put aside your desire to share the Gospel with Jews, there’s the door’”

      Christian Zionism is one aspect of the modern day apostasy in American Churches today, which is (for the most part) left alone and/or accepted.

  2. I hope someone will confront John Hagee with Brog’s word in the not too distant future. I’ll really like to hear his response. The bible is pretty clear about this. Peter, Paul, John were Jews they preached the crucified and risen Messiah to fellow Jews why not these people? We were not charged with defending any land or temple or real estate.

  3. I’m glad you highlighted David Brog’s latest article on Charisma. I saw that earlier today and was deeply disturbed by what Brog wrote and by a few of the comments. First of all, I really don’t understand why Charisma allows Brog to write articles for them when he has made it clear that he isn’t a believer, not to mention the fact that his ideas and agenda are anti-biblical.

    Brog effectively presented the Jewish people as our Savior instead of Christ. He quoted from an evangelical group which said that the Jews brought us the Messiah and the Bible, and for that we owe them a “debt of gratitude.” Brog didn’t say this himself, and of course he doesn’t believe it. Yet he started off his article with the same thought, without himself saying WHY we should “feel such deep gratitude to the Jewish people” and repay a “debt” to them.

    So he wants us to feel a debt that he himself doesn’t believe we should have (because to him Jesus wasn’t the Messiah). How can Charisma readers (and CUFI members) not see that Brog is simply using evangelicals for his own purposes?

    It was God the Father anyway who sent Jesus, not the Jewish people who “gave” Him to us.

    And why is Hagee outraged about Christ’s crucifixion? Jesus laid down His life willingly, and it was preordained from before time began that He would do so.

    Is there any truth to Brog’s statement that Martin Luther was anti-semitic, and that his writings contributed to the holocaust? I’ve heard this elsewhere, but I’ve never seen anyone back up this statement with any quotes from Luther. Supposedly Hagee has, but I’m not about to buy his books to find out what he said.

    • Brog effectively presented the Jewish people as our Savior instead of Christ. He quoted from an evangelical group which said that the Jews brought us the Messiah and the Bible, and for that we owe them a “debt of gratitude.”

      Brog didn’t say this himself, and of course he doesn’t believe it. Yet he started off his article with the same thought, without himself saying WHY we should “feel such deep gratitude to the Jewish people” and repay a “debt” to them.

      Adam, he was also directly quoting John Hagee. Hagee said exactly the same thing in his book ‘In Defense of Israel’. That book was one of the most disturbing books i’ve ever read…because it was written BY a well known name in Christian circles, and was totally “anti”-church.

      The author at Jews for Jesus has it right–Christian Zionism in America, is a political movement.

      And because it is, those like Hagee and the CUFI org. don’t really care that someone who denies Jesus, like David Brog, is appointed as the executive director of what most Christians wrongly believe, is a totally Christian organization. After all, their goal isn’t the salvation of the lost Jews in Israel, its being ‘the voice’ in Washington which represents Israeli politics.

      Is there any truth to Brog’s statement that Martin Luther was anti-semitic, and that his writings contributed to the holocaust?

      Adam i don’t know about Luther contributing to the holocaust, but there were things written by Luther which were understood to be antisemitic.

      Probably the most notorious was “On the Jews and Their Lies”

      http://www.humanitas-international.org/showcase/chronography/documents/luther-jews.htm

      From my understanding Luther is suppose to have written this in response to:

      “…alleged Jewish statements cited by Salvagus Porchetus de Salvaticus, a 14 century Cartesian monk in Victoria adversus impios Hebraeos.

      Luther was not simply out to bash the Jews in these works but to refute their “lies” and to defend Christ. These alleged statements were pretty offensive and Luther was obviously quite angry about them. Attacking the views of others was what Luther did best.”

      http://www.davnet.org/kevin/articles/lutherjew.html

    • PJ,

      Thanks for the info on Luther’s stance toward Jews. The daynet.org article was especially helpful in understanding where Luther was possibly coming from in his writings. It does sound like some of Luther’s angrier outbursts against the Jews were exploited by some Nazi hardliners, and that’s unfortunate. Still, this doesn’t discredit the Reformation or increase a supposed debt that we owe the Jewish people.

      Perhaps one day I need to read Hagee’s book, “In Defense of Israel,” just to get inside his head a little more. His thinking truly mystifies me. Is he deceived or a deceiver? I’m thinking more the latter. He has to be aware of Brog’s 2006 statement that “there is evidence that the alliance (CUFI) actually works to impede efforts to convert Jews.”

      Do you understand Charisma Magazine? I wonder if they have any standards when it comes to the “Standing with Israel” section of their magazine. You mentioned that Stephen Strang joined up with CUFI earlier this year. Do you know the nature of his involvement, or what Strang’s status is with CUFI? Is he a board member? I know that you and I and others have left comments under some of Charisma’s articles during the last few months, seriously challenging the premises of those articles and providing multiple Scripture references to point out their error. I wonder if Strang or the authors of those articles bother to read such comments, much less consider our feedback.

  4. You mentioned that Stephen Strang joined up with CUFI earlier this year. Do you know the nature of his involvement, or what Strang’s status is with CUFI? Is he a board member?

    He’s actually listed at CUFI’s website as a leader in Cufi’s organization. Go to the front page, (http://www.cufi.org/site/PageServer ) and if you watch the leaders scroll on the right, you’ll see it says Strang is a leader.

    He is the regional director for Christians United for Israel (CUFI) for Florida, Georgia, South Carolina and North Carolina.

    Srang has apparently [according to his words] been involved with Cufi since shortly after its inception, but its only been this year that he made it public knowledge through his magazine. (i should have made that clearer Adam)

    Hagee is the founder of Christians United for Israel (CUFI), an organization working to unify all believers who support Israel. I’m as involved in this group as I’ve been in any group in my 34-year career. http://www.cufima.com/id72.html

    Do you understand Charisma Magazine? I wonder if they have any standards when it comes to the “Standing with Israel” section of their magazine.

    AHA! i’ve said for years, Charisma mag. is a mystery to me.

    They can post a well written, solid biblical article [or commentary] one day and turn around the next and be promoting the “false prophet of the month” 🙂

  5. Adam, you might find this interesting.

    Below is a closing remark from an article written by a concerned Jew, about the members of CUFI.

    Under the circumstances, it would be wise for the Diaspora and Israeli Jewish community to distance itself from CUFI until Hagee can get his house in order. I know that’s a difficult and tall order to fill – especially in light of the outstanding and supportive statements and gestures emanating from that Christian body

    I met with Hagee confidant and friend Rabbi Arye Scheinberg four weeks ago at the home of Rabbi Simcha HaCohen Kook. I understand Rabbi Scheinberg had requested the meeting with Rav Kook in order to better understand certain positions the rabbinate has been taking.

    A Representative from the Jerusalem City Council and the director of a counter-missionary group were among those present at the meeting.

    Rabbi Scheinberg acknowledged the wealth of evidence and problems with certain CUFI directors, and assured me that Pastor Hagee was well aware of the situation with at least one of his main directors and publishers. I was told that Strang was “out” and that other changes were forthcoming.

    http://shilohmusings.blogspot.com/2008/07/theother-side-of-cufi-part-2.html#links

    The above was posted in July, 2008, so Hagee’s problem with Strang must have been resolved, for he’s still with the organization. I have a hunch, in light of the article itself, that the “wealth of evidence and problems with certain CUFI directors” had to do with evangelizing lost Jews.

    As Brog stated

    ‘If you cannot put aside your desire to share the Gospel with Jews, there’s the door’”

    • Yes, I think you’re right about the “problem” with Strang in 2008. Earlier in the article it is said of Strang, “He is perhaps the most problematic of CUFI’s regional directors.” The author then goes on to portray his “alarming” missionary activity.

      This implies then that various Jewish groups are putting pressure on Hagee any time one of CUFI’s leaders is linked to Jewish evangelism. I guess this shouldn’t be any surprise. How apostate this whole mess is, though.

  6. Before my computer crashed, i had a link to a website where stories were published daily, coming from Jewish journalists and bloggers, and discussed. One who posted there was Shiloh Musings.

    It was very interesting Adam to read anything posted about Hagee or Cufi.

    What i learned was that while the Israeli government and those businesses/groups inside Israel, who benefited monetarily from CUFI, accepted Hagee, the people by and large did not.

    What this showed me was that for all Hagee’s compromising of the gospel and Christ himself, in order to “love” Israel, it was for naught. They don’t trust him at all, and a few things i read actually seemed to portray deep animosity toward him and his organization.

  7. PJ, perhaps you’d also like to draw our attention to the more helpful articles on this column, such as:

    http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/newsletters/standing-with-israel

    All these are written by respected Jewish believers supportive of outreach. As I’ve said before, I’ve no time for Hagee, Eckstein, CUFI, or IFCJ, so please don’t tar every Christian supporter of Israel with the same brush.

  8. Hi sidefall…

    i removed your many links and substituted them with the one main one.

    Draw attention to the more helpful articles? I’ve included the link to that particular news section at Charisma many times. In fact a specific link to the article by Brog is included in the OP.

    All these are written by respected Jewish believers supportive of outreach. As I’ve said before, I’ve no time for Hagee, Eckstein, CUFI, or IFCJ, so please don’t tar every Christian supporter of Israel with the same brush.

    If the Christian Zionist movement doesn’t apply to you, why do you continue to defend it? You say:

    I’ve no time for Hagee, Eckstein, CUFI, or IFCJ…

    Yet, you nullify that claim when you promote the many articles posted at Strang’s newest magazine section. I’m not sure if you understand–Strang started this new section because of his active involvement, as a regional director, with Hagee’s CUFI.

    Christian Zionism is based on doctrines which are not biblical, so in that light, it requires it be pointed out as such.

    • PJ, I think you fail to understand that we’re talking about a big umbrella here. Observers, yourself included, tend to see everyone underneath it as one and the same, but in reality there is a wide spectrum of views.

      The “Standing with Israel” column includes articles by Barry Rubin (messianic Jewish publisher and congregational leader), Maoz Israel (charity that supports believers in Israel), Mitch Glaser (head of Chosen People Ministries, a long-established Jewish mission), Walid Shoebat (ex-terrorist now a believer), Barry Segal (Jewish believer from Israel), Avi Mizrachi (congregational leader from Israel), Jonathan Bernis (head of Jewish Voice, a large Jewish mission). I would encourage you to read their articles and see what they are saying.

      You may regard all the above as “Christian Zionists” and they are all strong supporters of Israel. But they have a markedly different approach to Hagee and CUFI. All are involved in outreach to the Jewish people, most are Jewish believers, and some are based in Israel. None of them reject evangelism, the charge that is at the centre of your writings.

      And Stephen Strang, despite his role as a CUFI regional director, is still willing to publish their writings. That’s commendable. The “Standing with Israel” column contains a broad section of views that is representative of those working in this field. But instead of commenting on that, and noting that the articles include those urging evangelism and support for messianic Jewish congregations, you instead focus solely on the bad bits.

      Christian Zionism is just a label, and a rather ill-defined one at that. If you regard it as what John Hagee stands for, then I’m going to object if you stick that label on me. But if you consider it to be what Barry Segal (for example) stands for, then I’ll happily be associated with that.

      It’s no different to the charismatic movement – I’m happy to be labelled a charismatic as I have a continuationist pneumatology, but I don’t want anything to do with the heresy and deception that is found in many parts of this movement (as exemplified by what happened in Lakeland last year).

  9. PJ, I think you fail to understand that we’re talking about a big umbrella here.

    No, im not talking about a big umbrella sidefall,. I’m taking about Christian Zionism–the movement and the beliefs surrounding it.

    Christian Zionism is just a label, and a rather ill-defined one at that.

    I disagree. Christian Zionism is well pretty well defined today, in America.

    Christian Zionism can be defined as Christian support for the Zionist cause — the return of the Jewish people to its biblical homeland in Israel. It is a belief among some Christians that the return of Jews to Israel is in line with a biblical prophecy, and is necessary for Jesus to return to Earth as its king.

    These Christians are partly motivated by the writings of the Bible and the words of the prophets. However, they are also driven to support Israel because they wish to “repay the debt of gratitude to the Jewish people for providing Christ and the other fundamentals of their faith,” and to support a political ally, according to David Brog, author Standing With Israel: Why Christians Support the Jewish State.

    Source, Jewish Virtual Library

    And Stephen Strang, despite his role as a CUFI regional director, is still willing to publish their writings. That’s commendable. The “Standing with Israel” column contains a broad section of views that is representative of those working in this field. But instead of commenting on that, and noting that the articles include those urging evangelism and support for messianic Jewish congregations, you instead focus solely on the bad bits.

    What is the title of the post sidefall? “How “Christian” is Christian Zionism?” Its not about highlighting various articles at Charisma, but pointing out the number which are posted by members of Christian Zionist organizations.–in this instance David Brog.

    The title is taken from the excellent article from Jews for Jesus…an organization led by born again Jews, working to take the gospel to lost Jews.

    They say:

    A new form of Christian Zionism emerged in the mid 1970s and early 1980s; it was more political and actually divorced itself from Jewish evangelism, contending that a Christian’s biblical duty to the Jews and Israel was best carried out through providing material comfort, political support and helping fund Jewish immigration to Israel.

    And they are correct. The American Christian Zionist movement today, is political, and not intent on sharing the gospel.

    Their theology leads them to believe that standing with and financially and politically supporting modern day Israel, regardless of any and all circumstances, is what the bible tells them to do. Its based on the teachings of ultra-dispensationalism.

    If you enjoy the articles at the Standing with Israel column, that’s fine, but i can’t promote them.

    • PJ, here are some quotes from the Standing with Israel column, as published by Christian Zionist Stephen Strang:

      “Don’t give up praying for your Jewish friends. Pray that God will reveal Jesus to them as their Messiah even today.”

      “But thanks to the unceasing prayers of believers around the world and the efforts of Messianic congregations in Israel, Jewish youth are coming to faith in Messiah.”

      “This is one of the reasons it is so important for Christians to pray for the peace of Jerusalem, take tours to Israel and participate in ministry in the Holy Land through direct evangelism, benevolence and other good works.”

      “What is disturbing, though, is the trend among many Christians and some Christian Zionists to sever their relationships with or withhold support from the Messianic Jewish community in Israel for the sake of maintaining ties to political figures or religious leaders. This trend is counterproductive for those of us who desire to see the natural and spiritual redemption of Israel. It is imperative that we stand in prayer and support for our Jewish brothers and sisters in Yeshua.”

      “As a local pastor, I have no doubt that God is moving in Israel today. Israelis are responding to the gospel and coming to the Lord. There is an openness that was not evident a few years ago. The harvest is ready.”

      “We must redouble our efforts to reach God’s Chosen People with the Gospel.”

      If you don’t wish to promote these sentiments, fine, but I certainly do!

      (Also, I’m not sure I would take my definition of Christian Zionism from a Jewish web site or David Brog!).

  10. What i won’t promote is Christian Zionism sidefall…

    Also, I’m not sure I would take my definition of Christian Zionism from a Jewish web site or David Brog

    Why wouldn’t David Brog’s definition or stated purpose behind Christian Zionism be applicable?

    He does head up the very organization which Charisma’s Strang works with…CUFI.

    I included the definition from Jewish Virtual Library, because i assumed you’d most likely already read the numerous articles concerning Christian Zionism on the Church Infected page…

    If you haven’t, you may want to check them out. (HERE)

  11. To clarify the position of the International Christian Embassy Jerusalem on witnessing to the Jewish people please go to http://www.icejusa.org/media and click on the article entitled ‘Tension of Jesus’ by our Executive Director Rev. Malcolm Hedding – an article in defense of the Great Commission that was first published in Israel by The Jerusalem Post.

    If you want to learn more about the theological foundations of biblical Zionism (as opposed to political zionism) – then follow the links to the various articles, monographs and teaching materials found on that page.

    Hopefully it will help shed some scriptural light on this important debate.

    In Jesus,

    Michael Hines
    International Christian Embassy Jerusalem

  12. Thanks for your response and the link Michael…

  13. I hope the article by Malcolm Hedding (who I have met on several occasions) will confirm that the ICEJ does not share the approach of CUFI that rejects evangelism. I have tried to express this same view in other comments but they don’t seem to have much effect.

    Here’s a quote: “The Jewish world must know that the call to be obedient to world missions, including the Jewish world, is not a small matter that can be compromised.”

    You’ll also note that Michael used the phrase “biblical Zionism” in his comment – in recent years ICEJ have started using this term as “Christian Zionism” has become associated with CUFI and discredited. Malcolm also told me that they want to make it clear that they do not endorse every action of the Israeli government, which, like our own, is composed of sinful men.

    That’s why, to answer your earlier question, I don’t take my definition of Christian Zionism from David Brog. CUFI is the “new kid on the block” and they have redefined the term in a way that other people, from the ICEJ right back to the London Jews’ Society of 1809, do not recognise.

  14. Sidefall i appreciated he took the time to comment, but it still does not nullify the very real dangers within the teachings of Christian zionism.

    Jews for Jesus made some pretty bold claims concerning the International Christian Embassy Jerusalem.

    A new form of Christian Zionism emerged in the mid 1970s and early 1980s; it was more political and actually divorced itself from Jewish evangelism, contending that a Christian’s biblical duty to the Jews and Israel was best carried out through providing material comfort, political support and helping fund Jewish immigration to Israel.

    These new Christian Zionist organizations, best represented by Bridges for Peace and the International Christian Embassy Jerusalem, made it very clear to Jewish leaders in Israel and abroad they had no intention of evangelizing Jews.

    If these are not true facts, the leaders of the embassy, those like Michael Hines, should contact them and straighten out any misunderstanding.

    Perhaps the 2 could work actively together, to take the gospel to the lost inside Israel, if they are both doing it separately now.

    • PJ, is there a contradiction? ICEJ have said that their particular calling isn’t direct evangelism, which is the same as what J4J states. However, ICEJ have also made it clear that they see their aid and advocacy as evangelism. In addition they support the Jewish believers in Israel, who are very much involved with outreach.

      I do wonder if you’d be similarly critical of, for example, World Vision, another evangelical organisation that doesn’t directly evangelise.

  15. And another thing… today I was at what could be called a Christian Zionist meeting. The speaker was the head of what could be called a Christian Zionist organisation. As well as talking about the current difficulties Israel faces in her war on terror, he spoke about the messianic believers in Israel and the need to support them in their outreach. The majority of our prayer time was devoted to this. He also gave an example of how his work standing for Israel had built bridges for the Jewish community that had enabled him to sensitively witness about Jesus to them.

    Overall, I felt the content was balanced, biblical, and well-informed.

    Today’s meeting further confirmed to me that the picture you paint of Christian Zionism is one that few would recognise. I have no problem with you pointing out the shortcomings of CUFI (or anyone else for that matter), but please do not suggest that they are representative of the entire movement, which sadly I think you have done on several occasions.

    • The Messiah physically returning at the end of the 70th week of Daniel is the fulfillment of Gabriel’s prophecy. (Dan. 9:24) When the fullness of the Gentiles is over (70th week), the Deliverer (Messiah) will come back from heavenly Zion and forgive Israel of her sins. (Rom 11:25-27) The Holy One will fulfill the mystery of God, the salvation of the remnant from Israel. (Rev. 10:1-7) The Jewish people will look Yeshua (Jesus) and believe in Him as their Lord and Savior. This not the coming of the Son of Man (resurrection) or the appearing of the Word of God at Armageddon (Rev. 19:11-21). In my new book, Til Eternity, the events making up the second coming are highlighted.

  16. PJ,

    I’d have preferred it if you’d engaged with my comments rather than just post a load of links.

    I actually watched the video (the first link) a couple of weeks ago.

    I’ve been aware of Stephen Sizer for many years, and I have major problems with both his views on Israel and his overall approach (he’s appeared on platforms with people who have supported terrorism). However, I actually agree with a significant amount of what he says in this video.

    All the links you gave focus on the extreme end of dispensational Christian Zionism. Like Rev Sizer, I think it’s unbiblical and dangerous.

    But how many times do I need to say that this is not representative of the whole movement? Nor is it my approach.

    Let me go back to an earlier comment of mine. Look through the articles included in Charisma’s “Standing With Israel” column. Ask yourself how many of them are promoting the sort of views that Sizer rightly condemns. Then ask yourself why you are spending a lot of time criticising the whole movement based on the errors of part of it.

    • Sidefall, we’re not going to agree on the topic of Christian Zionism, that’s why i posted links.

      There are times when 2 Christians just don’t see eye to eye on subjects outside of the fence which encloses the gospel.

      A couple of the links, i hoped would show you its the theology which Christian Zionism is built on, which i disagree with totally, and believe is serious error.

      ask yourself why you are spending a lot of time criticising the whole movement based on the errors of part of it.

      Sidefall, actually you are the one who is continuing this thread. And that’s ok, but sometimes we just need to accept that someone may not agree with us.

      Anyway, its been a good discussion, though we don’t see the topic in the same manner.

  17. PJ, as I said before, all the pages you linked to are directed against the extreme end of dispensational christian zionism. For the hundredth time, that is not a universal theological foundation for christian zionism, and I certainly don’t build on it.

    For example, on the ICEJ USA website that was given earlier, there’s a document called “Swords Into Ploughshares” which uses covenant theology to construct a biblical basis for christian zionism. Stephen Sizer himself is a covenant theologian and regards it as the opposite of dispensationalism. Like you, he fails to appreciate the theological diversity of Christian Zionism and tars everyone with the same brush. Sizer also condemns Jews for Jesus as Christian Zionists, an organisation you described as “excellent” in your original post. Does this not suggest that something’s not quite right?

    It is also possible, by the way, to build a very strong case for Christians to be Zionists based on history, justice, fairness, and morals, and completely ignore the role of the Jewish people and the land of Israel in the Biblical narrative.

    Can you not see that you (and Sizer) are treating Christian Zionism as a single entity where as in reality there are many different branches of it? Whilst I’m happy to use your term “serious error” in respect of some parts, it definitely doesn’t apply to everyone.

    It’s a bit like the Episcopal Church and the Anglican Communion. You could look at recent events in the Episcopal Church and conclude that they, and the whole Anglican Communion, are full of liberal theologians. But that is manifestly not the case, as I’m sure you realise.

    What I find really hard to understand is that you have not once responded to or interacted with my repeated statements that the approach to Christian Zionism that CUFI exemplifies is not shared by all Christian Zionists. Both Jews for Jesus and the ICEJ, to give two examples, have markedly different views to CUFI. But you seem to be incapable of realising this.

    As another example, have you actually looked through the Israel articles on Charisma? Have you noted the range of authors and views expressed? I’m not convinced that you have, and you just seem to be stuck with a preconceived mindset about Christian Zionism that is actually a misunderstanding.

    That’s why this thread has dragged on so long. So perhaps you could be so kind as to respond to my comments rather than just post links.

    We actually have quite a bit of common ground – I’m happy to join you in saying that Hagee is a heretic and CUFI’s approach is wrong. However, for the last time, they do not represent me or large numbers of other Christian Zionists.

  18. ” Whoever rejects me rejects He who sent Me..” and ” You call yourselves sons of Abraham but if you were you would be doing the works of abraham..indeed, you are the children of the devil and his bidding you willingly do…” Yea, I know the scandal of those who say they are Jews and are not, indeed they are a Synagogue of Satan..”
    In the New Covenant era ( the Old covenant is obsolete and not worth my dog’s poop ) a person is a “Jew” by Faith not by race…The Church is the new Israel and Christians in the Church founded by Jesus ( the Catholic Church ) are the people of God-and those who desire to be part of Her and part of the Mystical Body of Christ..One Faith, one baptism, one Church, one flock, one shephard, one Lord..

  19. Any “Christian” who “stands with Israel” should be force to read the Talmud..which refers to his Lord as a “liar” a “seducer of the people” a “child of rape” a “bastard” someone who is in Hell and “submerged in boiling excrement..” That says his mother had “relations with a Roman soldier” and was a “prostitute..”…Further, if he’s an American, he should apologize to every surviving member of the USS Liberty.

  20. John Hagee became a heretic the moment he announced Jesus did not come to be the Messiah in word or deed. In his book, Hagee denies Jesus as the Messiah eleven times. Anyone who does, according the apostle John, is antichrist. You cannot be saved and deny the doctrine of Christ. WAKE UP SAINTS!

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