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Bobby Jindal’s Story about Demons and Spiritual Warfare


HT to Polycarp for coming across this interesting post at CBN’s The Brody File

Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal, who gave the Republican national response to President Obama’s speech this week, wrote an article in 1994 in which he described being present when demons manifested and were cast out of a close friend. Brody seems to think this article would damage Jindal’s political chances in the future. He’s probably right.

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In 1994 when Jindal was in his early 20’s he wrote an article entitled, “Beating a Demon: Physical Dimensions of Spiritual Warfare.” In it he describes being present for what many would refer to as a spiritual exorcism. It involved his best friend  at the time “Susan.”  It is a truly captivating read… In many ways the whole experience left Jindal with more questions than answers..

The Brody File has read the entire article but had to pay $1.50. To do the same, click here. However, The Brody File has provided a major excerpt of it below. This is in Jindal’s own words and it is essential reading.

I’m sure some will read this and afterwards try to label Jindal as someone with strange religious views. But in typical Jindal fashion, he dissects the situation intellectually. He experienced something that clearly had a major impact in his life.

(A quick set up. Jindal’s best friend “Susan” has been diagnosed with cancer. She had been exhibiting unstable emotions lately and that is about to lead to a “prayer session” for Susan.)

A senior in UCF (University Christian Fellowship) and a leader of my Bible study group had once asked me if I believed in angels, spirits, and other such apparitions. I had recently heard a priest confidently proclaim that the Bible’s words on such phenomena were never meant to be interpreted literally; he had historical evidence that incidents involving spirits were merely metaphors for tangible events. Being a new Catholic and very eager to avoid the subject, I had accepted the priest’s views without question. After I related my doubts, the senior proceeded to describe recent incidents involving mutual acquaintances — e.g., a woman who claimed demons inflicted physical scars on her arms. I remained polite, but incredulous.

The issue of spirits did not affect me, and I was thus content to leave its resolution to others. I had no opinions or feelings on the subject.

But Susan was forcing me to take a stand on the entire issue of spirits and charismatic Christians. Having given the subject little thought, I was hardly ready to present an informed opinion. Susan was my closest friend and I would have tried to believe her had she claimed Martians had kidnapped her; friends are supposed to believe in each other even when nobody else does. Despite my verbal reassurances and lack of condemnations, Susan knew me well enough to see that I was having problems accepting her visions and spirits. I was doing everything I could to convey my support and sympathy; however, I was definitely in unfamiliar territory and was overwhelmed by the strength of her convictions.

I wavered between my loyalty to Susan and the apparent irrationality of her claims.

I left the room we were in for a moment, on some flimsy pretense, made the sign of the cross in desperation, and pleaded with God for divine assistance. Seconds after I re-entered the room, Susan angrily lashed out at me, telling me she never wanted to talk with me again since I did not love her, and ran out in tears. I tried following her, to no avail. I did not understand what I had done. All I could think was, “Gee, thanks God. So much for prayer.” I realized that Susan had never fully presented her interpretation of the recent events in her life, and I had not had the chance to accept or reject her claims. The entire conversation remained very nebulous in my mind, and many of Susan’s reactions made little sense. I had a vague sense that her anger and tears involved both my inability to care for her and also my inability to understand her recent experiences.

I was stunned, and so was hardly prepared for what was to follow the next day.

While Susan’s older sister flew in to provide comfort during this trying time, Susan visited the doctor for one last set of tests. UCF had organized a prayer meeting that night for Susan’s upcoming operation and the intense emotional trials she had endured. I called Susan, in an attempt to make peace, but was greeted with cold indifference. As she was hanging up, I asked if she wanted my presence at the prayer meeting. She declined the offer, but suddenly changed her mind just before the line was disconnected. I, along with several other students, gathered in a classroom, despite the hectic finals schedule, to offer our prayers and support for Susan. Since she was a very active member and Bible study leader in UCF, many upperclassmen were in attendance.

These students, the most active and experienced Protestant leaders on campus, came from different churches with different creeds.

The meeting started, as did any other UCF gathering, with group songs and a few prayers. We sat in a circle on the floor so we could face one another. Susan refused to acknowledge my presence when I entered. Though I was accustomed to feeling an emotional high during these meetings, I felt the initial songs were a bit dry. Given the circumstances, the group had lost much of its normal enthusiasm. Susan’s sister then asked for a period of meditative prayer, the entire group would fall silent while individuals would pray aloud “as the Spirit led them.” This is a common practice in both Bible studies and group meetings within UCF. My inexperience as a new Christian and my reserved nature prevented me from speaking during these times; rather, I prayed silently.

After a period of group prayer, a student made a movement to end the meeting. Suddenly, Susan emitted some strange guttural sounds and fell to the floor. She started thrashing about, as if in some sort of seizure. Susan’s sister must have recognized what was happening, for she ordered us to gather around and place our hands on Susan’s prostrate body. I refused to budge from my position and froze in horror. I will never forget the first comprehensible sound that came from Susan; she screamed my name with such an urgency that the chill still travels down my spine whenever I recall this moment.

Confused as to the events occurring before my very eyes, I responded to the desperation and cry for help so evident in Susan’s voice. I wanted to rescue my friend from these horrible people who were holding her down and ridiculing her dignity. I tentatively approached the group and placed the edge of my fingertip on her shoulder, as if afraid of becoming infected with the disease that was ravaging her body. I had yet to realize that the affliction was ravaging her soul.

In a voice I had never heard before or since, Susan accused me: “Bobby, you cannot even love Susan.” Before I even noticed the sound of her voice, I thought it funny that Susan would refer to herself in the third person. Then the full impact of the words hit me. Forgetting the frantic students around me and even poor Susan lying on the floor, I thought of our conversation the day before. The real argument had been whether I was capable of loving Susan. I needed the answer to be yes, more for my sake than ours. I have always been a closed and relatively unemotional person and needed to know that my best friend felt that I at least could love her, due to some very strong remarks made two years before by my former girlfriend (hardly an objective source), I was beginning to doubt that I had the capacity for feeling.

Knowing that I was doing Susan no good, I quickly retreated to the opposite side of the room. Susan proceeded to denounce every individual in the room, often citing very private and confidential information she could not possibly have known on her own. It was information capable of hurting individuals — attacking people, as she did, by revealing their hidden feelings, fears, and worries. The night was just beginning!

The students, led by Susan’s sister and Louise, a member of a charismatic church, engaged in loud and desperate prayers while holding Susan with one hand. Kneeling on the ground, my friends were chanting, “Satan, I command you to leave this woman.” Others exhorted all “demons to leave in the name of Christ.” It is no exaggeration to note the tears and sweat among those assembled. Susan lashed out at the assembled students with verbal assaults.

Though I attempted to maintain a stoic attitude and an expressionless face, my inner fear must have been apparent to all present. I was the only one present who remained silent and apart from the group.

I repeated to myself that such things do not happen to normal people.

I had attended a charismatic church once, out of curiosity, but had merely seen a congregation dance wildly, pray enthusiasti­cally, and speak in a language that sounded like gibberish. I wondered how the horror unfolding before my eyes could make any sense. I desperately wanted it all to end, but could not leave.

Then the fear and doubts began.

Though I have experienced the normal periods of questioning, I have never come so close to abandoning my faith as I did that night. I could not pray to God. I tried as hard as I could, but I couldn’t. Out of desperation, I called upon the saints to articulate my prayers and rescue me from this living nightmare. Though I had never prayed with the saints before, I began to understand the Church’s teaching of the unity within the One Body. I pleaded with the saints in Heaven to offer God the prayers I was unable to formulate.

Susan’s sister sent someone to call a local minister experienced in such matters. Some desperate part of my brain wondered if we should also call the campus priest. I wanted the full authority of the Church to confront this demon, or whatever was causing this horrible scene. I wanted the priest to bring the Eucharist and watch the spirits fall before the power of Christ’s Real Presence.

But I was scared. I wondered what would happen if the Eucharist did nothing and the priest was helpless. What if the consecrated Bread was just bread? What if the Church had no power over the cause of Susan’s bizarre behavior? I was unable to pray and too frightened to test my Church’s spiritual strength.

I, like many other students feeling the effects of the night, was swaying from exhaustion. I was mentally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually drained of everything I possessed. I was ready to give up. I rubbed my hands over my face and through my hair in an attempt to stir hidden reserves of energy. Though her eyes had been closed the entire time and I was kneeling several feet away, Susan must have sensed my actions. Addressing me for the second and last time, Susan told me to leave because I was tired.

Whenever I concentrated long enough to begin prayer, I felt some type of physical force distracting me. It was as if something was pushing down on my chest, making it very hard for me to breathe. Being a biology major at the time, I greeted this feeling with skepticism and rational explanations. I checked my pulse for signs of nervousness and wondered what could cause such a sensation. Shortness of breath is a common symptom that can mean very little or may signal the onslaught of a fatal stroke. Though I could find no cause for my chest pains, I was very scared of what was happening to me and Susan. I began to think that the demon would only attack me if I tried to pray or fight back; thus, I resigned myself to leaving it alone in an attempt to find peace for myself.

I gave up all attempts at prayer and admitted conditional defeat. The effort succeeded and I felt relief immediately. There were no more mysterious forces and I was able to watch the proceedings with the security of an outsider, beyond the immediate reality of the frenzied action I was witnessing. It may have been I was trying too hard to pray and be there for Susan; however, the sense of fear and dread felt like more than mere anxiety at the time.

Maybe she sensed our weariness; whether by plan or coincidence, Susan chose the perfect opportunity to attempt an escape. She suddenly leapt up and ran for the door, despite the many hands holding her down. This burst of action served to revive the tired group of students and they soon had her restrained once again, this time half kneeling and half standing.

Alice, a student leader in Campus Crusade for Christ, entered the room for the first time, brandishing a crucifix. Running out of options, UCF had turned to a rival campus Christian group for spiritual tactics. The preacher had denied our request for assistance and recommended that we not confront the demon; his suggestion was a little late. I still wonder if the good preacher was too settled to be roused from bed, or if this supposed expert doubted his own ability to confront whatever harassed Susan.

Alice’s presence countered Susan’s recent burst of energy, and Alice’s confidence inspired us all. Surely Crusade’s experienced leader would be able to rescue us and reaffirm our faith in Christ, the Bible, and everything good. Even I felt confident enough to approach God once again; Susan’s lunge for the door awakened and invigorated me. Strangely, I found myself repeating the Hail Mary until it became a chant. Being a recent convert to Catholicism, I had yet to accept the Catholic doctrines concerning Mary and considered any form of Marian devotion to be idolatry. Though I had never before prayed a Hail Mary in my life, I suddenly found myself incapable of any other form of prayer. Somehow, Mary’s intercessions allowed me to find peace during that long night; I knew that I had survived the worst and that I would exit with my faith intact. It terrified me to recall how close I came to turning away from Christ out of fear.

The crucifix had a calming effect on Susan, and her sister was soon brave enough to bring a Bible to her face. At first, Susan responded to biblical passages with curses and profanities. Mixed in with her vile attacks were short and desperate pleas for help. In the same breath that she attacked Christ, the Bible’s authenticity, and everyone assembled in prayer, Susan would suddenly urge us to rescue her. It appeared as if we were observing a tremendous battle between the Susan we knew and loved and some strange evil force. But the momentum had shifted and we now sensed that victory was at hand.

While Alice and Louise held Susan, her sister continued holding the Bible to her face. Almost taunting the evil spirit that had almost beaten us minutes before, the students dared Susan to read biblical passages. She choked on certain passages and could not finish the sentence “Jesus is Lord.” Over and over, she repeated “Jesus is L..L..LL,” often ending in profanities. In between her futile attempts, Susan pleaded with us to continue trying and often smiled between the grimaces that accompanied her readings of Scripture. Just as suddenly as she went into the trance, Susan suddenly reappeared and claimed “Jesus is Lord.”

With an almost comical smile, Susan then looked up as if awakening from a deep sleep and asked, “Has something happened?” She did not remember any of the past few hours and was startled to find her friends breaking out in cheers and laugh­ter, overwhelmed by sudden joy and relief.

My expression must have betrayed my former fears; Stacy, a freshman I hardly knew, asked about my welfare. I was startled that anyone would be offering me assistance when Susan should have been the focus of attention. I eventually left the room in a stupor. As I was leaving in a crowd, Susan’s sister, who had met me once years before, called my name and asked that I “commit my nightlife to prayer.” I hardly understood what she meant and was startled that others continued to single me out for attention. I nodded and looked gently at Susan, who thanked me for coming.

Though I waited for a friend to avoid being alone during the walk home, the rest of the night proceeded without incident. My nightly prayers, despite my apprehensions, came to me easily and I no longer had any problems approaching God; indeed, I left that night with a reaffirmed faith in God’s power over any force in or out of this world. If the night’s events had not seemed so real, I would have thought my earlier fears silly.

(Jindal’s final conclusion in the article is below:)

I left that classroom with a powerful belief in Mary’s intercessions and with many questions about spiritual warfare; I also learned a lasting lesson in humility and the limits of human understanding. Was the purpose of that night served when so many individuals were inducted into the Church?

Did I witness spiritual warfare? I do not have the answers, but I do believe in the reality of spirits, angels, and other related phenomena that I can neither touch nor see.

27 comments on “Bobby Jindal’s Story about Demons and Spiritual Warfare

  1. I have some questions for anyone who is willing to jump into this topic… 🙂

    If possible, i’d like to hear from someone who is familiar with casting out demons.

  2. Lately, this forum has been making me rethink my thoughts on spiritual gifts. I begin to wonder if maybe it is all real after all. A shame, however, that I know of no Church worth attending. A place where I might find Christians who can speak to me truly.

    I don’t know much about casting away demons, but I do have some stories that happened to me when I was maybe 15-17 years old. Maybe older, I cannot remember. I had either a period in which I was either insane, or a period in which I was tormented by demons physically. It started very small, like shouts in my left ear or in my right ear during the night. Waking me up as I had just begun to fall asleep. Later it escalated somewhat, where I would feel something touching my leg or stroking my hair. I remember once opening my eyes expecting to see my mother, but I was all alone. It is possible I fooled myself, but those were things I woke up thinking had happened at first. It continued like this for awhile, and I think it was around this time that I had first began falling into Pentecostalism. Basically, praying in alleged tongues and such which I later determined to be self deceptions. I thought that there was a connection to it.

    So, time passes and my night life and early mornings continued like that. At that point I barely thought if it very often and considered it to be just daydreams and nightmares. However, one morning, or actually it was about 1 or 2pm, I had stayed up all night long before till daybreak and went to bed as the sun came (like a vampire LOL), I found myself in an interesting dream. The first part of the dream was about some ghost in a painting, and I thought it was a sad ending to a movie or something of that nature. Suddenly, however, I was transported into a great cavern filled with green smoke. I was on my belly on hard stone unable or unwilling to move. When I looked around, I saw a man or a manlike person dancing around me in a circle. He was tormenting a snake. Picking it up, slapping it, throwing it back down, kicking it. He did this for awhile and I was very afraid the snake would notice me and take out its revenge on me. I tried to stay still so it would not notice me. However, as soon as I had thought those things the snake came around from where I couldn’t see and bit into my left arm.

    At that moment I woke up. I was on my bed in the same position as I was in the dream, and on my left arm I felt a very strong “grip” or gripping pressure that made one part of my arm completely numb. It was like a hand was squeezing me there and holding me down. At the same time, I could hear a noise coming from above me. Maybe a foot or two above me, and a little to the right near my bedroom window. It was a noise that I cannot mimic or properly describe. It was like a cross between a snake hissing and an animal growling. It was very loud, and hung over me with all its might.

    I told myself that I was crazy. It wasn’t real, I reasoned. It could not be. I told myself to stay calm and that once I regain control of my mind I will be free of the manifestation. In my panic, I began quoting one of my favorite movies (and books) to free myself from it. Thinking back it is rather silly that I even said it. “I must not fear, fear is the mind killer.” I began to mouth the words, but discovered I was so terrified that I could only mumble them. I began saing like so, “I–I–I, m-mmmm-mussst – n-n-n-ot feeear..” This went on for awhile, it felt like an eternity but could have been perhaps a few minutes laying there trying to get the words out. Suddenly I gave up and, without even thinking about it, shouted perfectly “The Lord is my Shield!!” The moment I said that the noise ceased, and the pressure on my left arm went away.

    • Ricardo, i don’t believe you were insane…it sounds to me as though you were being spiritually attacked by demons. I had similar experiences many years ago…

      In my panic, I began quoting one of my favorite movies (and books) to free myself from it. Thinking back it is rather silly that I even said it. “I must not fear, fear is the mind killer.”

      You know what came to me immediately when reading that? That the Holy Spirit was attempting to bring to your remembrance the scriptures, “perfect love casts out all fear” and, “God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind”. (that’s why its important for us all to read the word daily–for the Spirit of God cannot bring up what hasn’t went in)

      Suddenly I gave up and, without even thinking about it, shouted perfectly “The Lord is my Shield!!” The moment I said that the noise ceased, and the pressure on my left arm went away.

      Praise the Lord! See, you spoke ‘the word’.. (read psalms 28 and 18)

      They had to flee at the word of God..

  3. Oh yeah! And one time I got licked! I was waking up in the morning and felt a warm wet tongue lick me. I thought it was my niece and that it was her sickening strategy to force me awake (I play dead). I felt it was inapproriate, but that I would not fall for the provocation. As I thought she came in again, I decided I would throw her off. As the heat became stronger from her breath I opened my eyes and pushed her away with my hands. However, there was no one in the room. This actually happened after the events I described before. For a short time it began again, and I would hear voices calling my name when I was alone. However, all of that went away and has not happened again for many years. Besides those events, after I prayed all the issues ceased.

    Of course, could be I was temporarily a Skitzo. I’m super intelligent you know, and they say great intelligence is not many steps away from insanity :p.

  4. And I’m sorry for my poor writing, it’s 3:47am and I’ve become a buffoon!

  5. I wouldn’t exactly say I have direct experience, but I have heard a few stories from friends. I know a little bit.

    One of the big things is that I know it does not exactly matter how loud and commanding you can make your voice. It’s whether you actually have authority, which, if you have been commissioned by the MOST HIGH, you very much do have that authority.

    I think that an excellent example of this is the encounter of the seven sons of Sceva in Acts 19.

    “And the evil spirit answered and said, “Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are you?””

    Are you a threat to the principalities and powers of the air? Do they know you? Not that it is important, for we are to be known by God and seek that first, above all else. (I do not believe we are to go seeking after those powers of the air to overthrow them as in “spiritual mapping” I believe it’s called.) But do we choose to live in opposition to them in the manner of the cross. In the manner of willing to die by living in opposition of them. For that is the manner in which Christ Jesus did so. That is one facet of the cross that we seldom understand. Not that I claim understanding of it, but I do at the very least know of it.

    I’m sure there is someone that frequents the board that is more knowledgeable than I am in such matters, but feel free to ask.

  6. “The crucifix had a calming effect on Susan, and her sister was soon brave enough to bring a Bible to her face.”

    Icons and idols. If Jindal is a Roman Catholic (one who puts confidence in a crucifix), it’s a no brainer that he would be susceptible to myriad deceptions, drawing him away from Truth.

    For sure, demonic activity is real and I suspect most Americans have no idea. But I am just as certain that what the Roman Catholic Church teaches about such activity is not to be trusted.

  7. Bobby Jindal’s story would not be a shock to such a highly Catholic area as Louisiana. I believe he will be in place for as long as G-d has determined.

    What a story of deliverance. Were it not for the cancer, it could be that Susan would not have submitted to that night of prayer.

    • maizie, i thought it was interesting too…(and believable)

      The reason i agreed with Brody, that Bobby Jindal’s written account of this could stop his run for president, is because most people would think he was either a nut or lying: and that goes for many who claim to be christians as well. You’d be surprised to know the number of believers, those who have been saved for years, who deny any demonic activity today. Such an account, as the one above would sadly, never be believed by these Christians.

      Bobby Jindal would be mocked not only by the media, but in many christian circles too.

  8. This shows the growing alliance between certain Roman Catholics and certain charismatic/Pentecostals. I can recall successfully casting out a demon only once. I know of others who have done so much more often, however. Casting out devils and other forms of spiritual warfare used to be a primary topic of interest to me. However, ever since reading Romans 7:7-25, I have started wondering how much spiritual warfare is simply people claiming “the devil made me do it” and preferring to war against evil spirits rather than confronting their own fallen and sinful natures, issues that according to this passage continue even after a person is fully regenerated. Then I also became very concerned that a lot of the spiritual warfare doctrines and tactics did not correlate to Biblical accounts. I did read that they somewhat resemble Roman Catholic tradition and also the Jewish traditions in the Talmud. However, are we Protestant Christians supposed to be in the business of creating and following our own tradition based on our experiences – experiental religion – or are we to be sola scriptura and adhere to scripture as much as possible? I have noticed that more of a few of the third wave Pentecostals getting increasingly hostile to sola scriptura – accusing us of “Bible idolatry” and “worshiping a book” and “putting God in a box” – because their experiences are increasingly not lining up with scripture. As a matter of fact, it appears that they are more and more into simply prooftexting – coming up with isolated, out of context scripture fragments, and also use varying translations also to find what they need – to justify their actions and doctrines and have completely rejected anything that has to do with consistency, the integrity of scripture, or the rule of faith, claiming that the Bible is limited so Holy Spirit guidance and revelation are more important anyway.

    So before I get back into spiritual warfare, I am going to have to acquire two things.

    1. The ability to discern between the activity of evil spirits and people’s ingrained sin habits as described in Romans 6-7.
    2. How to cast out demons the way that the Bible says happened. Not Catholic exorcisms. Not Talmudic rabbinical spiritual deliverance (which, based on the little that I read of it, sounds a lot like “The Pigs In The Parlor” method). But what the New Testament described Jesus Christ and His apostles doing, which was “and he straightway commanded the spirit to come out of her, and the spirit departed” type of thing, with just the spoken word in the Name and Power of Jesus Christ.

    • This shows the growing alliance between certain Roman Catholics and certain charismatic/Pentecostals.

      Job, i was hoping you’d comment. I knew of your interest in spiritual warfare when i first found your blog a couple yrs back.

      Yes, what you said is what brought one of my questions to mind.

      First i’d like to say that Jindal’s written account appears 100% real to me. I’ve seen similar manifestations during casting out demons. And to be frank, Jindal’s own words as to how he responded, could have been written by me, the first time i witnessed demonic manifestations. It totally takes one aback…you’re stunned and literally frozen to the spot, unable to react, the first time you witness demons speaking through others, fighting, cursing God, screaming out incidents about you, which you believed were only known by you and God, etc…. Its also not just what is seen and heard which causes this reaction, but also the overpowering sense of spiritual evil which accompanies it all. After the first time you learn through later instances, to ‘push through it’ in the power of Christ.

      His first hand account sounded of truth to me…

      But what i questioned were the Catholic applications or actions, which were taken to subdue these spirits…

      For if brandishing a cross or placing a bible on the persons head is acceptable practice in casting out demons [acceptable to God, and acceptable to the demons themselves–in that they have to obey when these are used) then im totally stumped!

      How could this be so?

      Is it perhaps not the action of using these things but the words spoken when doing so (with authority) in the name of Jesus, and the person doing the casting out having the faith to believe, that made these spirits obey?

      Like you, i have witnessed many tactics used in casting out demons–many of them totally unscriptural. And like you, these tactics bothered me a lot. I’ve went home after many such incidents thanking God for delivering the person IN SPITE of the ignorance shown by many of those casting out spirits. (its God doing the delivering anyway)

  9. I really don’t want to jump into this topic but I have seen and been involved with some of this over the years and now know just enough to get myself in trouble. Demon possession is real but like many other things it needs to be spiritually discerned. Some things are natural occurrences in the physical body that are just part of this fallen world, but others are oppression and possession by spirits. Discerning the difference is where it gets tricky and I have no pet answers. Also, I have seen way too much nonsense over the years with all of this so I am very cautious to respond quickly to what is perceived to be demonic.

    I have witnessed and seen the power of the Lord Jesus Christ to free people from the bondage of demonic power numerous times. I have no problem when the situation arises to carefully jump in. But having said that I have attended seminars being taught on demon possession that had people believing they needed cleaning of all manor of demons in their lives. True misguided hogwash to put it mildly. The Church is losing its ability to discern not only in this area but many other areas as your blog so greatly testifies about. Too bad there is a mind set of fast and hard rules in the kingdom of God on how God does what he does each and every time. Each situation needs to be handled with the leading from God’s council not from the latest seminar learned from some traveling “expert”!

    This article makes me hurt for the massive ignorance in the church. I have witnessed people trying to use bibles and crosses as instrument to attempt to make demons flee. Crosses and bibles hold no power. They might testify to the truth but there is no power in paper, metal or wood. The power is only in the Spirit of God to deliver, not in pages of print. I watched some people trying to cast out a spirit from a teen boy one time. They where yelling at the spirit and holding bibles on his stomach. NOTHING was happening. His eyes were transform to two black dots on the white eyeball, no color at all. His chest was bouncing on the floor like a basketball being dribbled only inches off the floor. His speech was not his own but coming from deep within his body. The voice inside was saying “you can’t make me leave”. Two pastors that know the power of the Lord came up to the boy. They took the bibles off his chest, looked deep into his eyes and not with any yelling but with the authority that is only learned by a real revelation of the Father told the spirits they had to leave. The kid became like a dishrag as the foul spirits left. He was no longer tormented. No formulas, no yelling, just doing what had to be done in that situation. By the way, this episode, young in my Christian life, sealed the fact that the gospel was true and what is written in scriptures is authentic and alive.

    • Demon possession is real but like many other things it needs to be spiritually discerned. Some things are natural occurrences in the physical body that are just part of this fallen world, but others are oppression and possession by spirits. Discerning the difference is where it gets tricky and I have no pet answers.

      I agree. Not everything is caused by demons. Though if you talk to some christians who are heavily involved in deliverance ministries, they try to convince you of the opposite.

      You might find this interesting. One thing i learned when working in one of these ministries is, if you begin to be convinced that demons are behind everything, you’ll begin to actually see them everywhere: in everyone you talk to, in church, etc etc…

      Its as though satan says ‘ok, you want to see demons, here you go’

      Its a dangerous position to put yourself in.

      Discerning then casting out demons is a part of the great commission–key words “A PART OF”— not the whole. Too many Christians who become involved in these type of ministries wrongly believe its more then just a part, but the ‘whole’ shebang ..

  10. Bobby Jindal’s story is very interesting, yet believable. I noted the Catholic icons and idolatry, as others also did. I’ve never cast a demon out of someone in a one-on-one situation, but I have witnessed a couple exorcisms first-hand and have seen some other clearly demonic activity. So I’ll share these experiences here as briefly as I can:

    [1] When I was in youth group about 13-14 years ago one of the youth suddenly manifested a demon during a worship service. He started growling, thrashing, throwing chairs, and pretty much launched a pool table. The youth pastor at the time, a huge guy, jumped on him and told the demon(s) to leave in the name of Jesus. It was over rather quickly. I believe that particular youth was a visitor. I don’t really remember him attending much before or after that event, and I knew nothing of his spiritual state.

    [2] During my Senior year of high school the Lord gave me an unmistakable prayer burden for a girl who was in the marching band (as I was; and, by the way, I had no physical attraction for her). She had seemingly become a Satanist overnight. Twice I was woken up with an urgency to pray for her, and felt it was a matter of life and death, and on both occasions I learned from others that she had tried but failed to commit suicide at those very times. Anyway, there were also a couple of occasions where I felt an urge to pray for her when she was in eyesight, and she did something which made it clear that “her demons” weren’t happy about it. On one occasion when I felt such an urge to pray, the band was lined up and waiting to go onto the football field at halftime. Almost as soon as I started to pray, she stepped out of the line (well ahead of me), turned around, and stared me down with her face contorting in anger.

    A month or two later, our band was in Indianapolis for national competition. As it was a weekend, we stayed at an empty school. During one of our free times, I had the privilege of leading someone to the Lord who happened to be a follower of Marilyn Manson. He knew that he had to get rid of his Marilyn Manson CD (“Antichrist Superstar”), so we went to a far corner of the school and smashed it on the floor of the men’s room. There was no way anyone else could have known by any natural means what we had done. However, as we were returning to the other end of the school where everyone was, this girl came walking down the hall with a few of her friends, shouting, “I know what he’s done! Adam must be sacrificed on the altar to Satan!” I graduated without seeing this girl come to the Lord, but her close friend (a troubled girl from a gypsy family) was radically saved later that year.

    [3] Also during my senior year of high school, I was praying in an open area in my parents’ basement late one night when I felt an evil presence. I then saw a dark figure (4-5 feet tall) walking around our ping pong table on the other side. There was no confrontation, as I didn’t feel a need to have one. I would describe what I felt as a raw fear and sense of evil, yet at the same time I felt peace. After a minute I went to bed and calmly “prayed myself to sleep.”

    [4] After my first year at Christ for the Nations I joined a team of 43 people on a summer trip to South India. We were in Madurai (a.k.a. Temple City) one day and held a prayer meeting (in which I felt the group was rather arrogant, presumptuous, and overmatched…it was a wicked place) on top of a tower overlooking the city. That night at precisely 4:30 am every single person on the team was woken up and attacked in various ways by demons. My roommate and I simply felt an intense evil in the room and saw a shadowy figure pass in front of a mirror. Others on the team, however, became violently sick, or saw strange things (demons swinging swords; “666” being written on the wall in bright, red letters; etc.). We left town the next day at noon, a day earlier than planned.

    [5] Very early during my time in Malaysia I joined a group of Chinese Methodist young people on a trip to visit a couple of Orang Asli churches (The Orang Asli are Tribal peoples, minorities who live more primitively than the rest of the population; the term means “Original People.”). A few of the young people were praying over an Orang Asli lady who, from all appearances, had been “slain in the Spirit” (something these Methodists were not accustomed to seeing, incidentally). As they were down on the ground praying for her, she suddenly began manifesting demons and rose up without the use of her hands and with her body kept completely straight. So she pivoted only on her feet/ankles as she came up; it was the wildest thing I’ve ever witnessed. Six of them tried to hold her down, but she was too strong. A couple ministers (pastors?) came running over, and 2-3 minutes later she was walking out the back door with them and in her right mind. I don’t know what they prayed, because at that time I didn’t yet know the Malay language.

    [6] Two members of a family I know well in Malaysia were at one time demon-possessed, though it happened before I knew them. They live in a medium-sized city, and are a successful family by most standards. The father is a helicopter pilot, the mother is chief of police, they live in a nice house, and their five boys have always excelled in school. The demonic activity started when their family maid, offended somehow by the mother, hired the services of a “bomoh” (witch doctor) to curse her. It worked, and she became demon-possessed. Her son, Azlan, who couldn’t stand the sight of his mother’s suffering, confronted the demons and commanded them to leave her alone and bother him instead. They obeyed.

    His mother was “cured,” but Azlan was now possessed. According to his family and friends (and the local newspaper), he was able to throw heavy furniture across the room with superhuman strength, and he even outran a motorcycle. He also caused mass hysteria at his school, and several dozen students ran around the premises screaming uncontrollably. One girl was so affected that, for nine months, she couldn’t come within 100 feet of her own house or she would faint (I also knew her personally after all this had happened). Azlan was eventually “cured” as well by the services of a bomoh (they put charmed leaves/herbs above his door frame, used amulets, etc.), but he wasn’t cured of his fear. I’m inclined to believe that those demons became idle or perhaps did move on, as this still allowed Azlan’s family to maintain their trust in witch doctors, another form of bondage.

    This family hasn’t yet come to faith in Jesus, but they have been open to hearing the gospel, and are intrigued by Biblical accounts showing Christ’s power over demons. Azlan is the most open, but I’ve also seen his father visibly shaken when I (and a couple others) shared the message of the gospel with him. If you feel moved to do so, please pray for this family that God will open their eyes to the truth and draw them to Himself.

    • Adam, thank you so much for sharing these experiences….(you and Job both)

      I was struck by the last one in Malaysia. This in fact:

      Azlan was eventually “cured” as well by the services of a bomoh (they put charmed leaves/herbs above his door frame, used amulets, etc.), but he wasn’t cured of his fear. I’m inclined to believe that those demons became idle or perhaps did move on, as this still allowed Azlan’s family to maintain their trust in witch doctors, another form of bondage.

      This is an excellent point Adam…

      Demons will hide or stop their obvious manifestations (for a season) if it will bring the person [or those around them] into further spiritual bondage. It appears this is what occurred here.

      Question: Do you think this occurs when well known false prophets or teachers cast out demons, and it appears on the surface to have been successful? I think it does…

      Satan wants to place a seal of approval on his ‘own’–those who seem to operate in and by the power of God, but are in fact not. In this way he can gain followers for his false teachers, and ‘believers’… Once these people gain a following then they can be easily led [by the one satan uses] to accept false teachings/doctrines, etc etc…Why? because now they believe everything this “powerful” man or woman says….after all, they watched them cast out demons!

      The example of the people you mentioned, who now believe in the power of the ‘bomoh’, should be a lesson for us all: it doesn’t have to be a witch doctor, it could be someone claiming to be a christian.

      Discernment is SO important today.

      Yes, i’ll remember this family in prayer…

    • PJ,

      Thank you for committing to remember Azlan and his family in prayer. Thanks also for your feedback. Yes, I agree with you that it’s very possible that demons will roll over and play dead in the presence of false (professing Christian) ministers, if this serves to gain more followers for these deceivers. Interesting correlation… So these false ministers are another form of bondage just like the witch doctors in Malaysia, and it appears that for the enemy this is often just as strategic as having someone clearly overcome by manifesting demons.

  11. pjmiller (and solar):

    I got out of some of the more Pentecostal/charismatic doctrines and practices (healings, spiritual warfare and deliverance, miracles, prophesying, vigorous emotional worship) to learn more about theology and church history. However, in the course of doing so, I didn’t find what I was looking for, because many of the people that produce the “respected” theology and church history are either cessationists or are trying to replace spiritual things with philosophy, psychology, and similar. So, it looks like it is very easy to err by going to far to one side (third wavers who reject sola scriptura) or to the other (cessationists who don’t seem to know or care that cessationism is unbiblical, and also people who aren’t technically cessationist but still run away from anything resembling the supernatural because 1. it scares them and 2. it isn’t “respectable”).

    I tried to look for information on spiritual warfare and deliverance as practiced by Reformed/Calvinist folks, couldn’t find a thing, as so many of them are cessationist. (By the way, the cessationism arguments sound very much like “there is no need to evangelize the heathen because the great commission was given only to the apostles and completed by them” arguments.) I suppose that I need to get back into those things using the Bible as the instruction manual.

    As far as Roman Catholics and others performing legitimate spiritual deliverance, including legitimate exorcisms, I have no doubt that it is so. Read Matthew 7:21-23! “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.”

    So lots of people are casting out devils, but they are still goats, not sheep. Why? Because they fail on this point: “but he that doeth the will of my Father“! So sure, Bobby Jindal’s people may cast out their share of devils, but they still pray to Mary, angels, and icons, so they are disobedient to the Will of God the Father. The same is true of these Benny Hinn/Kenneth Copeland/Oral Roberts/Paul Crouch/Todd Bentley/Kansas City prophets types. I don’t doubt that they do great works. But the Bible makes it clear that a person can do great works and still be disobedient, unsaved, and on his way to the lake of fire. So, such a person as that should not be followed, and his doctrines should not be practiced. Even if he is speaking the truth in some area, one can get that truth from someplace else.

    For example I received my gift of salvation by hearing the gospel preached by this preacher who claims that the Incarnation of Jesus Christ came about by way of prophets speaking Jesus Christ into existence using the Word of Faith. Was my salvation, based on hearing the truth about what this preacher said about Jesus Christ’s work on the cross, legitimate? Yes. So, this preacher’s mighty work in the Name of Jesus Christ with regards to preaching the gospel and my hearing and believing was legitimate. But do I follow that preacher any more or listen to anything else that he has to say? No! Now I suppose that I could learn from that guy’s teachings how to lead someone to Jesus Christ. But why when I could learn the same thing from Ray Comfort, Paul Washer, and Voddie Baucham? Trying to rehabilitate doctrines preached by unregenerate disobedients is the same as putting lipstick on a pig. (A phrase that I was completely unaware of before the presidential campaign. A poor excuse for a country boy I am!)

    So, PJ, how many spiritual deliverance occurrences do you remember that closely conformed to the Biblical accounts? I can recall of one. One morning, I was awakened by the fact that I was dying, I was literally, 100% quite literally, dying, about to lose consciousness, because of what appeared to be a chronic lung infection that had sent me to the emergency room and doctor’s offices several times; they had prescribed various antibiotics and steroid treatments for me to no avail. My kid, less than 2 years old and barely able to speak, ran into our bedroom waking my wife yelling “Daddy need help, Daddy need help.” My wife asked me what was wrong, I gasped something at her, and she laid hands on me (whether it was my head or chest I do not recall) and yelled (though not exceptionally or particularly loudly, she did not scream it, but rather stated it emphatically and with authority) “in the name of Jesus, evil spirit I command you to loose him right now!”

    At that instant, my breath returned, and I have not had any recurrences of this illness since. Also, I am leaving out a bit. Prior to this, I had been in the bondage of internet pornography for years. The night before incident happened, I had pledged to get rid of the computer that I was using to access the Internet (and the pornography) the next morning on my way to work. As you can probably guess, immediately after this incident, I made good on that pledge. This added information makes it clearer that what my wife performed on me in the Name of Jesus Christ that morning was not faith healing, but spiritual deliverance, commanding an evil spirit that was causing my sickness to leave. (By contrast, the asthma and kidney swelling that left my body a few months earlier during/after a family prayer session was faith healing.)

    As to the one instance of casting out a devil that I am certain that I performed, it was nothing like what my wife did. Instead, it was using the “Pigs In The Parlor” method. And do you know what else? This was before I heard that Word of Faith preacher’s gospel message. So, I wasn’t even yet born again when I cast the devil out in the name of Jesus Christ. So until I gain more knowledge on this issue, I would state that there is a right way and a wrong way to perform spiritual deliverance. (Or should I say a right way and many wrong ways.) What I did during my one successful (and also my many many many failed!) attempts to cast out devils was the wrong way. What my wife did to save my life that morning was the right way, as it was consistent to how the Bible recorded Jesus Christ and Paul doing the same.

    • [QUOTE]So lots of people are casting out devils, but they are still goats, not sheep. Why? Because they fail on this point: “but he that doeth the will of my Father“! So sure, Bobby Jindal’s people may cast out their share of devils, but they still pray to Mary, angels, and icons, so they are disobedient to the Will of God the Father. [/QUOTE]

      This feels like vanity. That I say it feels like vanity feels like vanity also. I wonder if Bobby Jindal and other Catholics are truly “goats” and not sheep. I think the scripture teaches that one person might venerate a Holy day while a other person might not acknowledge it. One person might refrain from eating meat while another person does not refrain at all. Though one believes differently than the other, they are justified in that they do it for the Glory of God, even if they are in error.

      Obviously, with the freedom God has given us we can eat plenty of meat. And we need not venerate Saints or Holy Days… However, does that truly make us better or more Holy than those people who make such errors? In the end, aren’t we all just pitiful sinners in need of heavy chastisement? Don’t we all deserve to cook in hell for an eternity? If they still believe in Jesus Christ and are cleansed by his blood, as you are, then why must they be a condemned Goat because of their error? I would like to think that the mercy of God is great enough to forgive even the most hard headed of papists… And Charismatic fools. We should pray for our fellow sinners, not judge them as Goats or heathens. It stinks of vanity, as if we are somehow capable of knowing that we ourselves are not Goats and Heathens also. That is not to say that I excuse error, in fact I hate error. But I wonder if you are righteous enough to throw the first stone?

    • Ricardo, im sure there are many who would disagree with me, but i don’t consider all Catholics lost or goats. In my lifetime i’ve met Catholics which i knew without a doubt, were washed in the blood of Christ and saved. I’ve also met Protestants who claimed to be saved, but i wouldn’t have bet the farm on it being true..

    • As far as Roman Catholics and others performing legitimate spiritual deliverance, including legitimate exorcisms, I have no doubt that it is so. Read Matthew 7:21-23! “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.”

      Job, those have always been the most frightening verses in the bible to me…

      Read Adam’s post above yours…do you think its a possibility that when these demons appear to leave that they don’t…but just stop openly manifesting so as to convince the ‘exorcist’ they are gone? (im talking about instances when the person is using questionable tactics)

      I ask because i’ve known them to hide–or what my dad use to call, play possum. I’ve also seen this ploy work…unless someone is present with the discernment to know differently–to know they are still there, and speaks up to let others present know.

      After all the goal of the demons to get the person they are inhabiting out of there!

      They can also put on quite a show of leaving, and not go anywhere. Or, one can leave while others still present ‘hide’…

      I wondered about that possibility in the case of the young woman Bobby Jindal wrote about.

      So, PJ, how many spiritual deliverance occurrences do you remember that closely conformed to the Biblical accounts? I can recall of one.

      Very few Job… in fact the point was reached at one time, in which i told God i wanted nothing more to do with it. It was that bad.

      God pointed me to a scripture which changed my mind and caused me to repent:

      “A curse on him who is lax in doing the LORD’s work! A curse on him who keeps his sword from bloodshed!” Jeremiah 48:10

      Once the Holy Spirit reveals a spiritual truth to us, as in the case of demons and their work against man, we cannot walk away. God showed me it would be sin on my part if i turned my back and laid down my sword.

      With revealed knowledge comes personal responsibility to act upon that knowledge.

      I read the account about you and your wife. What a testimony Job–not only to the spiritual bondage you were in, but to how God used your wife to set you free from your tormentors!

      To me, what she did was totally biblical… and the way it came about. I’m willing to bet she wasn’t even ‘thinking’ of doing this, that it just happened; she obeyed the Lord without hesitation on her part. That is like what Paul did in Acts 16.

      Whats also interesting in this account of Paul, is that he did not demand this spirit to leave right away…

      And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying: The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying, These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation. And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.

      These scriptures showed me years ago we have to wait upon the Holy Spirit..we just can’t go around casting out demons on a whim.. LOL

      You mentioned Pig in the Parlor, i remember reading the book back in the early 80’s… in fact i believe its still on my bookshelf. Believe it or not, i actually learned a few things from that book.

      If you ever want to read some really ‘wild’ books on deliverance, check out books written by Win Worley.

  12. Ricardo,
    I completely agree with your above statements above regarding not being so quick to judge Catholics as goats. My dear grandmother was a lifelong Catholic, I am not. Her son (my father) left the Catholic church and became born again and so I was not raised Catholic like many of my cousins. She just recently passed away. While at her visitation the Lord blessed me with the time to read many of her poems and essays that has been compiled in a few books. She only wrote about the Lord and her love and faith in Him. Her faith in Jesus was so apperant in the words of her writings that I felt such a tremendous peace at her funeral although I sat through the saying of the rosary and the whole Catholic mass. Yes, she had some errors in her beliefs but the blood of Jesus covers those too. She was a truly spirit filled woman who lived the greatest commandment. The Lord’s presence was at her Catholic funeral and my ex-Catholic dad was allowed to speak at it (although her church does not usually let non catholics speak unless they write down what they will say and it is approved by the priest beforehand, which was not done) and tell everyone there that Grandma would want all to come to Jesus that day and that she would say “it is all about Jesus”. Praise God for His mercy on us sinners!
    Diana

  13. The so called Catholic icons are evidenc of a person’s belief. I have my doorposts marked with red paint as a reminder of the Passover. No power in the paint a comfort to me of G-d’s promises.

    Satan i.e. spirits know what you believe through what comes from your own mouth and familiar spirits are around many people which keep contact with one another. Satan does accuse and who sits beside the Father as our attorney/intercessor? Jesus Christ.
    How do spirits have access to us? Through disobedience.
    I have seen more spirits around churches then one would expect-slander, gossip, hate, envy-remember the scripture to get rid of all malice, envy, anger..1 Peter 2:1 These should not be found among those who call themselves Christians.
    People see spirits all the time but believe it is a person [example: unclean spirits] but if our war is not against flesh and blood then why do we continue to war against flesh and blood?

    The main point of the article is not Jindal’s Catholic beliefs but that he has acknowledged the spiritual warfare which most deny exists.

  14. ricardo:

    It is me that judges Roman Catholics as goats, it is scripture that does so. Look Ricardo (and Diana and the rest of you), what of homosexuals, then? Do homosexuals have the freedom to eat plenty of meat so long as they profess believing in Jesus Christ? As a matter of fact, take your entire reply and replace “Catholic” with “homosexual.” The same Bible that condemns Catholic doctrines condemns homosexual behavior. Accepting the former without accepting the latter is simply homophobia, plain and simple. So in order to be consistent according to scripture, go to all of the ministries out there dedicated to helping homosexuals come out of that sinful lifestyle and tell them to stop judging and casting stones. The Holy Spirit convicts believers of all unrighteousness. So do you honestly do not believe that the Holy Spirit is not telling these people to stop praying to Mary and angels, and that they are not resisting Him? Look, the gulf between “salvation by works/you can lose your salvation/the pope ultimately decides who goes to heaven and who doesn’t because he is the vicar of Christ and sits in the throne of Peter” Roman Catholics and sola scriptura is so wide that we both cannot be right. Either they are wrong or we are.

    Ok, maybe the homosexual versus Catholic thing was wrong. What about Mormons? Jehovah’s Witnesses? Oneness Pentecostals who deny Trinity? Are righteous enough to throw the first stone at them? I will tell you the difference: because Catholics have been around longer and there are more of them, and that makes believing that claiming that Mary is the perpetual virgin and queen of heaven (the Roman goddess Venus) or that Christianity requires you to be a cannibal and literally eat the flesh and drink the blood of Jesus Christ (transubstantiation) is somehow preferable to oneness Pentecostal’s being an extremist about Deuteronomy 6:4’s “the Lord is one” or Colossians 2:9’s “in Christ dwells the fulness of the Godhead” or for that matter the Jehovah’s Witnesses and Mormons using Colossians 1:15-21 to say that Jesus Christ is the firstborn of creation means that He is a creature.

    I see no reason to prefer Catholics over Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses, and ESPECIALLY oneness Pentecostals other than the fact that Catholics are more numerous and more respected. As a matter of fact, Roman Catholics are not even older, because the modalist, Arianist, and Sabellianist heresies that Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses, and oneness types are actually older than Roman Catholicism, some of them dating back to even the time that the New Testament epistles were being written. So, folks were claiming that Jesus Christ was a creature and rejecting Trinity hundreds of years before it was ever claimed that the bishop of Rome was the vicar of Christ.

    Incidentally, you should also recognize that ever since Vatican II, Roman Catholicism is now officially a pluralistic faith, which declares that there are many paths to heaven. So Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, you name it … so long as they are people who faithfully practice their own religion and are basically ethical and moral, they will go to heaven. They will have to sit in purgatory for a little while, of course, because they were never baptized into Roman Catholicism, did not receive last rites, or complete any of the other Roman Catholic sacraments. But ultimately, they will all wind up in heaven right alongside you.

    So is it “casting stones” to point out that the Roman Catholic Church rejects John 14:6’s ”
    Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me”? Again, the answer is NO, because it is not me that casts stones against the Roman Catholics, but the Bible itself. Either the Bible is wrong or the Catholics are wrong. Pick one.

  15. Just a note..

    Did anyone catch the interview with Bobby Jindal on tonights 60 Minutes?

    It was pretty interesting… It was mentioned how he left the faith of his family and became a Catholic while in his late teens [i believe]…

    So do you honestly do not believe that the Holy Spirit is not telling these people to stop praying to Mary and angels, and that they are not resisting Him?

    Job, i sincerely believe the Holy Spirit is…

    Its really strange [or perhaps not] that the Catholics i have known [mostly through my job] which i truly sensed were saved, did not appear to embrace certain practices, like praying to saints, or Mary. Isn’t that odd? I thought it was at the time. But for whatever reason, they still considered themselves ‘Catholics’.

    It just a thought but i’ve wondered if the reason for this is first–the Holy Spirit has shown them it is wrong, and secondly because there are more Catholic Churches which are becoming charismatic.

    There is one church in my area, St. Lawrence, which is over the river in Cincinnati and is one of the oldest [Catholic] churches in the area. (in lower Price Hill, a poor area of town) They have also been considered [by staunch Catholics in cincy] to be ‘renegades’ but other Catholics (and non-Catholics) attend regularly.

    The reason they are frowned upon by older Catholics is because they have been holding twice a month prayer and anointing/healing services for the last 20 years. Everyone is welcome. They practice the gifts of the spirit at these services, and from my understanding from those who have attended, its more like a pentecostal worship service.

  16. [QUOTE]It is me that judges Roman Catholics as goats, it is scripture that does so. Look Ricardo (and Diana and the rest of you), what of homosexuals, then? Do homosexuals have the freedom to eat plenty of meat so long as they profess believing in Jesus Christ? As a matter of fact, take your entire reply and replace “Catholic” with “homosexual.”[/QUOTE]

    So, the other poster’s sweet Catholic grandmother is actually a closet homosexual?

    [QUOTE]Incidentally, you should also recognize that ever since Vatican II, Roman Catholicism is now officially a pluralistic faith, which declares that there are many paths to heaven. So Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, you name it … so long as they are people who faithfully practice their own religion and are basically ethical and moral, they will go to heaven. They will have to sit in purgatory for a little while, of course, because they were never baptized into Roman Catholicism, did not receive last rites, or complete any of the other Roman Catholic sacraments. But ultimately, they will all wind up in heaven right alongside you.[/QUOTE]

    You’re preaching to the choir. I’ve debated with Papist priests in my time and have fought against the Marian worship and prayer to saints. However, there is a strong difference between even the worst Papists and people who are committing sins such as homosexuality. It is true that these things are false, however, if you are a pentecostal I would maybe label you a heretic in the same fashion. Out of all the pentecostals I have ever met, the vast majority of them were vapid. Shallow. Useless. Having no real spiritual power, just self delusion. Perhaps I could say that your Pentecostalism is just as much a cult as the Roman theology. However, even then I still wouldn’t call you damned right off the bat. What really matters is how God views you, not the errant theology you have. There are alot of Christians also with correct theology who will be going to hell, I guarantee it.

  17. Many Christians believe that Catholic charismatics are true believers because of their Pentecostal like practices. Please read the article at the link below which I found at endtimesprophetic. I have experienced this first hand, having been in the Catholic Charismatic movement for a few years before I was saved. (I have spent almost 40 of the 60 years of my life in mainstream Roman Catholicism. I was born again when I was almost 40.)

    http://giannina.wordpress.com/2009/01/04/the-roman-catholic-charismatic-movement-more-christian-or-less/

    The bottom line is that Rome preaches “another gospel.” God’s Word says so. Let me put it this way . . . if a Muslim becomes born again, we expect them to leave the Mosque etc. If they don’t, we will obviously question the validity of their Christian profession. The same would hold true for a Hindu, Buddhist, Mormon, Jehovah Witness, etc. It is no different with the Roman Catholics. To think otherwise is to embrace one of the biggest delusions to ever come down the pike. God’s Word must be our plumb line, not our feelings.

    To all my brothers and sisters in Christ, I would say that if someone tells you they are a born again Catholic, your discernment should kick into gear. Think oxymoron. Actions speak louder than words, or should I say you will know them by their fruit.

    The bottom line . . . Roman Catholics need to be evangelized. They need to be born again. When they truly are, and their faith is genuine, it won’t be long before they leave the Catholic Church.

    Sometimes I just want to throw up my hands and say believe what you want. I don’t do that because souls are at stake. Seems so many Christians remain unconvinced that “Roman Catholicism is the devil’s masterpiece” as a pastor I knew once said. So true.

    Let us pray for Bobby Jindal, a former Hindu, perhaps seeking truth, but led astray by “another Jesus” that will not save his soul from hell.

    Cathy

    Cathy

  18. I had a sermon about the Gadarene demoniac (Mark 5:1-20) posted last August 2008. In summary, what I said was these:

    (1) Satan and his evil spirits are real, fallen spiritual beings.

    (2) Exorcisms by mere humans are powerless; only Christ (and his apostles) can cast out demons, because he is sovereign over all.

    (3) All humanity belongs to one of two kingdoms: believers in the kingdom of God; unbelievers in the kingdom of Satan. Therefore, all unbelievers are, in reality, demon-possessed.

    (4) The only real exorcism of evil spirits is accomplished by the preaching of the gospel of Christ, which is able to create faith in Christ in an unbeliever, setting him free from the kingdom of Satan.

    (5) This is so because Christ has already defeated Satan and his demons at the cross. And when Jesus returns, Satan and his angels will suffer the ultimate judgment – the eternal lake of fire.

    (6) Therefore, no real believer can be possessed by another spirit, because all Christians are indwelt by the Holy Spirit of God. How can both Holy Spirit and evil spirits indwell the same person at the same time?

    Read the sermon here: http://www.twoagespilgrims.com/doctrine/?p=351 .

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